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Ever heard of Dvorak Keyboard? 

What do you think?
Dvorak OWNS!!!! 18%  18%  [ 2 ]
Qwerty OWNS!!!! 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
I know Qwerty too well to switch. 36%  36%  [ 4 ]
It isn't that big of a deal. 45%  45%  [ 5 ]
I don't want to learn a whole new system. 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Total votes : 11

Ever heard of Dvorak Keyboard? 
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-- To vote that your gunna try switching or anything, simply leave a post and vote "Dvorak OWNS!!!!"... I dunno how to edit the vote system now that i've added it :P. --

As I am aware, Qwerty Keyboards have taken the whole world under an ignorant little cloud where they have absolutely no idea about any other type of keyboard...

Well, first off, let me explain how it was for me with my qwerty keyboard...

-- I was mistaking sometimes.
-- I was typing pretty slowly (70- WPM)
-- I was sometimes crossing my fingers.
-- I was getting this annoying sensitivity in my pinky sometimes.

Then, I asked my doctor what I should do considering the fact that I was gaming 12-14 hours a day and typing every minute of it. He said, "Get off the computer" and, of course, I didn't like that plan...

I searched around and found this odd keyboard named "dvorak"... This keyboard was made for a better purpose and helped me out alot... I haven't had a single problem with my hands since.

Here is a few quotes from: http://www.powertyping.com/dvorak/keyboard.html#dk

First off, let's see what they had in mind while creating the Qwerty...

Quote:
Qwerty was designed and patented in 1896 by Christopher Latham Sholes, the inventor of typewriter. Originally keys were laid out in alphabetical order which caused frequent jams of moving parts. Sholes rearranged the keys so that most frequently typed letters were spread apart to minimize the jamming. He obtained a patent for this keyboard layout which became known as QWERTY and became US standard 101 keyboard.

With the invention of electrical typewriter in 1930's which used a ball to type letters rather then moving arms, an opportunity arose to redesign keyboard layout to improve typing efficiency.

From numerous keyboard layouts proposed and tested, Dvorak keyboard became the alternate American standard.


That doesn't sound too good, let's see what the dvorak was made for...

Quote:
It was designated an alternate standard keyboard layout by the American National Standards Institute (ANSI) in 1982. In 1984 the Dvorak keyboard had an estimated 100,000 users. Today Dvorak keyboard layout software is available in Windows, Mac, Linux operating systems.

It has also been called the Simplified Keyboard or American Simplified Keyboard, but is commonly known as the Dvorak keyboard. It was designed by Drs. August Dvorak and William Dealey in the 1920s and 1930s. The two studied letter frequency and the physiology of the hand and created the layout to adhere to these principles:
    It is easier to type letters alternating between hands.

    For maximum speed and efficiency, the most common letters and digraphs should be the easiest to type. This means that they should be on the home row, which is where the fingers rest.

    Likewise, the least common letters should be on the bottom row, which is the hardest row to reach.

    The right hand should do more of the typing, because most people are right-handed.

    It is more difficult to type digraphs with adjacent fingers than non-adjacent fingers.

    Stroking should generally move from the edges of the board to the center (as an example, rap your fingers on a table and see which is easier: going from pinkie finger to index or index to pinkie). This motion on a keyboard is called inboard stroke flow.

The layout was completed in 1932 and was granted U.S. Patent No. 2,040,248


Now that you know how it is made, let see what the studies show it improves on...

Quote:
The benefits of learning Dvorak keyboard:
    * increased comfort - (the top reason for typist suffering with RSI)
    * increased efficiency
    * better accuracy
    * faster
    * shorter learning curve (estimated 50% shorter then Qwerty)


Here are some fun things to think about :P.... But first, look at the dvorak keyboard layout...

http://www.dvorak-keyboards.com/dvorak-keyboard_com.gif

This is the layout, notice where the vowels are? The vowels are on the left hand, and the most common consonants are on the right.

However, there is one advantage of the qwerty keyboard...
-- You can type the word "TYPEWRITER" on one line only... So, if you ever need that then you should stay with qwerty 4 sure.

Here's another site with tests/results and etc. about Dvorak.

http://shiar.org/happy/txts/dvorak.php

Now, your either thinking one of two things...

A. WTF? Why haven't I heard of it, and why would I want to switch and is this thing bull crap?

-- My answer to this is... You haven't heard of it because you haven't looked... You would want to switch because of a wonderful thing called RSI injuries (such as carpel-tunnel) which Dvorak helps fight. It is not bull crap, it is the simple truth...

B. Well, I don't have much money as it is... How much do Qwerty Keyboards cost?

-- Absolutely nothing... Simply follow some easy steps and you can get your qwerty keyboard for free... (or $5 from some random Hardware store).

Here are the steps...

#1. Change Keyboard Look...

-- You can either change the keys physically, or re-write on them...

By physically I mean using a screwdriver or some tool that is flat and simply pluck out all the keys... And then place them back in the Dvorak Layout Way...

-- You can re-write them...

You can simply use a marker and re-write them... (You can do what my friend did and simply put on a piece of tape or use a labeler with easy-peel tape... That way you can take them off with ease).

#2. Change Keyboard Layout...

I only really can help you out if you use Windows... But here are the steps...

Go to Start --> Settings --> Control Panel...

Click on "Regional and Language Options".

Click "Languages" and then Details...

Now, click "add..."

A new box will appear, make sure "Keyboard layout/IME" is checked, and then using the box under that, scroll down and find "United States-Dvorak".

Click "ok".

There is a list of things, and in the category "Keyboard" there should be "US" and "United States-Dvorak". Click on "United States-Dvorak", and then click "Apply" and then "Ok".

Your keyboard is now switched. If you want to switch back, simply go back to regional and language options... Click "US", click "Apply" and then "OK".


-- FAQ --

#1. Will this make my computer lag at all?

-- There is absolutely no difference... Keys are sent to windows exactly the same way, and the speed is exactly the same...

#2. Will I have to re-learn to type?

-- Well, I wouldn't think of it as re-learning to type, because it will probably take alot less time than it did to learn to type... You don't really re-learn how to type as well, its more of a re-learn the keys... You still use homerow and everything else exactly the same.

#3. How common is Dvorak?

-- Not very, Alot of people know qwerty and dont' really care about switching... No body really cares about their hands or anything until they finally get carpel-tunnel or any RSI injury... In which case they are unable to even type so why try a different keyboard layout?

#4. What is a RSI Injury?

-- RSI stands for (Repetitive Strain Injury). Let me tell you a little bit about our hands...

Our hands can't handle much stress, and we put alot on them... This causes the bone to wear down, and causes RSI's.

Carpel Tunnel is something gained after you ignore its messages... (like any numbness in yoru hand after typing, or anything that is stiff, sore or not comfortable).

I can't really explain it more, I hope you understand that it is simply just too much stress on something not ready for stress...

Here is a page with much more details regarding Carpel Tunnel (The most common RSI): http://www.ninds.nih.gov/disorders/carp ... tunnel.htm

#5. Can I get RSI with this keyboard?

-- Most definitely... But the chances are significantly reduced.

#6. What are others to reduce my chances of RSI's?

-- I'm not a doctor, but I can recommend some things that will help...

Don't play games (or type) for more than a half an hour to an hour at a time... If you play for an hour, lay down and rest your hands for 20. If you play for a half an hour, lay down and rest for 10 minutes.

-- Don't play more than an hour at a time, it is just bad.

Exercise your hands, stretch them out (don't crack them). Move them by yourself and don't put pressure on them with your other hand... (Wiggle them for about 2 minutes, and then rest for a good 5-6 minutes.)

Avoid bad posture, and listen to your body. Try to leave your arms at a strait angle... (Leave the top part at a 90 degree angle [strait down] and then your bottom arm at a strait line.). Now, it doesn't have to be exact but it should be comfortable and it should be strait and not slanted. If your hands ever hurt, get sore, get stressed, or numb in any way... Take a break and talk to a doctor about it.

My ideas are just suggestions not to START getting it, once you see any symptoms you should contact your physician for help.


Wed Sep 17, 2008 6:21 pm
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To all those who voted "it isn't that big of a deal"...

You may not know about RSI injuries, but they are there and are extremely painful...

If you play on a computer atleast once a day (even if for 5 minutes), you are at risk for getting carpel-tunnel or any of the horrible problems that RSI causes.

As a quote from "RSIWARRIOR", a site dedicated to helping RSI...

Quote:
Various RSI sufferers have switched to the DVORAK keyboard layout as it relieves the hand action during typing. It may surprise you to learn that the common QWERTY keyboard layout was specifically designed to maximize hand movements and to be most inefficient. The reason being that older typewriters used to get jammed by touch-typists. Unfortunately this convention has continued into the information age.


A quote from TypeMatrix

Quote:
Users of the Dvorak Keyboard may be faster and make fewer errors than an equally qualified QWERTY typist, but most importantly, stress on the fingers, hands and wrists is greatly reduced .


A quote from TiFaq (Typing Injuries Frequently Asked Questions) about the dvorak keyboard...

[quote]
Repetitive Stress Injury (RSI) alleviation

- Because the most commonly used letters are in the home row, you do not need to unnaturally extend your fingers to reach them: your hands do not have to move around as much to type common words.
- The common letters are more evenly divided between the two hands. Therefore, it is less likely that just one hand will be used to type certain words (like the sentence, “Sara grew great trees.â€


Thu Sep 18, 2008 9:43 am
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Jeeze, did you invest stock in a Dvorak keyboard company or something?

I’ve been typing up a storm for, well, without giving away how old I am, well over 30 years now. I was especially prolific back in high school with short stories, novellas, rpg modules, and fanfic (albeit, before the term was coined), where I typed up several dozen bibles worth of text. I know this, for I saved everything in pure text format in this pre-HardDrive era, and the archives of my work came out to well over 30 stuffed floppies, ranging in formats from 5.25â€


Thu Sep 18, 2008 11:28 am
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Saint Thoth wrote:
So, f*ck Dvorak! Qwerty forever! :P


this


Thu Sep 18, 2008 2:55 pm
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Here are just a few statistics released by the The National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health.

QUOTE from http://www.repetitive-strain.com/national.html

Quote:
849,000 new cases of carpal tunnel syndrome occurred in 1994.-National Center for Health Statistics.

Approximately 260,000 carpal tunnel release operations are performed each year, with 47% of the cases considered to be work related.-National Center for Health Statistics.

A report by NIOSH revealed that more than 50% of all food cashiers, (jobs predominantly held by women), suffered some degree of carpal tunnel syndrome and other forms of repetitive strain injuries as a result of the physical demands of scanning products at high speed.

Currently, Carpal Tunnel Syndrome affects over 8-million Americans.

Presently, 25% of all computer operators have Carpal Tunnel Syndrome, with estimates that by the year 2000, 50% of the entire workforce may be affected.

Only 23% of all Carpal Tunnel Syndrome patients were able to return to their previous professions following surgery.

Up to 36% of all Carpal Tunnel Syndrome patients require unlimited medical trearment.


As rare as it may be where you live, I have seen it affect MANY people... The simple fact that you have ever had soreness is a sign that you have some RSI. I'm guessing you still have a long time to live, probably 20-30 years atleast. Well, If it's already affecting you now... How bad do you think it is going to be in a couple years?

Oh and by the way, Carpal Tunnel is an instantaneous thing... You see, while it grinds down muscle/bone it doesn't hurt at all... So, if you have ANY sign of it that means that you have already worn down muscle/bone quite a bit...

So, while you might say "f*ck dvorak"... I say "f*ck not being able to use my hand".

But, this is an educational thread... It isn't a forceful thread nor is it a hateful thread... I understand that alot of people are unable to switch to dvorak for whatever reason... Most of them don't even know that it is out there (I wonder why *looks at logitech and every other company making tons of money with qwerty keyboards *).

If you don't switch, you don't switch... But, just remember that you still have a long time to be using those muscles... Make sure you don't ruin them all before it is too late.


Thu Sep 18, 2008 3:23 pm
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Have you heard of the Jehova's witnessess?? Can I come in !?!?!? WOULD YOU LIKE A PAMPHLET >!?>!>!?!??!?!?!?111


Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:39 pm
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and dvorak is just one of the more popular unpopular layouts

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Fri Sep 19, 2008 1:35 am
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Dvorak_Luvr wrote:
The simple fact that you have ever had soreness is a sign that you have some RSI. I'm guessing you still have a long time to live, probably 20-30 years atleast. Well, If it's already affecting you now... How bad do you think it is going to be in a couple years?

Thothie_Master_of_Redundancy wrote:
Despite all this Qwerty keyboard abuse, I’ve never developed a chronic wrist problem of any sort.

Further proof that Dvorak causes reading comprehension skills to deteriorate!


TAK wrote:
and dvorak is just one of the more popular unpopular layouts

Like Colemak…
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Totally pwns Dvorak! Dual backspaces for the win, baby! (Plus the movement cluster would be “warsâ€


Fri Sep 19, 2008 5:26 am
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Well, for copy and paste I can either do 2 things... I can either do it the normal way for dvorak and the dvorak "v" is where the qwerty "." is. Which, isn't such a big deal to be honest with you... OR, If I am going to copy/paste tons of things (10+) I usually just do "ALT+SHIFT" and it switches to qwerty, do ALT+SHIFT again and its back to dvorak.

I'm not even going to attempt to argue with such an ignorant group of people... No matter how many facts, studies, or simple truths I tell you, your going to stick with your way...

To use a common atheist phrase... "Why is it that you question and ridicule everything, unless it is the first thing you try". Simple fact is, they didn't have to say anything or do anything to get you to use Qwerty.

Well, thanks for having an open mind guys...


Fri Sep 19, 2008 3:46 pm
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no problem

welcome to the jigglyroom

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Fri Sep 19, 2008 3:52 pm
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theone wrote:
Well, for copy and paste I can either do 2 things... I can either do it the normal way for dvorak and the dvorak "v" is where the qwerty "." is. Which, isn't such a big deal to be honest with you... OR, If I am going to copy/paste tons of things (10+) I usually just do "ALT+SHIFT" and it switches to qwerty, do ALT+SHIFT again and its back to dvorak.

I'm not even going to attempt to argue with such an ignorant group of people... No matter how many facts, studies, or simple truths I tell you, your going to stick with your way...

To use a common atheist phrase... "Why is it that you question and ridicule everything, unless it is the first thing you try". Simple fact is, they didn't have to say anything or do anything to get you to use Qwerty.

Well, thanks for having an open mind guys...


I’m sorry. I’m just makin’ fun of yer rather fanatical devotion to the keyboard layout. ;)

TBH, I’ve nothing against Dvorak. Although I suspect my wrists are so tuned to Qwerty from several lifetimes of using it, that I’m more likely to injure myself attempting to switch formats, than I am to prevent it. ;)
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Fri Sep 19, 2008 4:07 pm
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theone wrote:
I usually just do "ALT+SHIFT" and it switches to qwerty, do ALT+SHIFT again and its back to dvorak.


Its funny that this one statement almost invalidates your entire argument against qwerty, seeming as to how i don't have to switch into Dvorak format at any time for any reason. Who's format is inferior now, eh?

theone wrote:
Simple fact is, they didn't have to say anything or do anything to get you to use Qwerty.

The simpler fact is people use what's convenient and available. Qwerty is the standard in this country. What, am I supposed to cart around a Dvorak keyboard with me everywhere I go? I need to check my email but fuck me I can't type on 99% of the publicly available keyboards in this country because I decided to learn a keyboard format that nobody uses?

Also this argument ranks a 9/10 for most pointless topics to ever grace this board, and that's saying alot coming from a guy who started a 75 page thread about the epic battle between pie and cheese.

I'm more likely to get carple tunnel from chronic masturbation.


Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:19 pm
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Post 
...


Last edited by C4K3 on Wed Sep 24, 2008 11:23 am, edited 1 time in total.



Sat Sep 20, 2008 3:51 am
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TheDoc wrote:
theone wrote:
I usually just do "ALT+SHIFT" and it switches to qwerty, do ALT+SHIFT again and its back to dvorak.


Its funny that this one statement almost invalidates your entire argument against qwerty, seeming as to how i don't have to switch into Dvorak format at any time for any reason. Who's format is inferior now, eh?


It doesn't invalidate anything... In fact, If it were just so needed I can go into windows and edit the default copy/paste button... That is how un-needed it truely is, that the 5 seconds it would take to edit it isn't worth just doing CTRL + ".".

You see, your an opportunist... I give a list of options, and you simply pick and choose one of them to try and make your arguement seem more important... I VERY commonly use CTRL + . because it is simply so easy for me, BUT if someone were just starting dvorak I offered a different option.

You, being an ignorant little e-thug who knows all and is always right, will argue against every option I give to help all those who need it. It's ok tho, it's simply what you do when you are confused and don't understand.

Quote:
theone wrote:
Simple fact is, they didn't have to say anything or do anything to get you to use Qwerty.

The simpler fact is people use what's convenient and available. Qwerty is the standard in this country. What, am I supposed to cart around a Dvorak keyboard with me everywhere I go? I need to check my email but fuck me I can't type on 99% of the publicly available keyboards in this country because I decided to learn a keyboard format that nobody uses?

Also, your idea of lugging around a dvorak keyboard is absolute non-sense and completely pulled out your ass. You have not read my post, nor any thing I have made. Once you have learned Dvorak (One week or so is all it takes) you no longer LOOK at your keys... You can simply take 7 seconds to change the keyboard configuration and instantly your done.

Quote:
Also this argument ranks a 9/10 for most pointless topics to ever grace this board, and that's saying alot coming from a guy who started a 75 page thread about the epic battle between pie and cheese.


Thank you for stating something that is absolutely irrelevant... "Showing your true colors"?

-- Because you were so ignorant, I'm going to be ignorant... --

Tell me, did they teach you to be this ignorant at school in texas? Or is it just a genetic trait all of you share.


Sat Sep 20, 2008 11:43 am
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pie totally wins over cheese

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Sat Sep 20, 2008 11:50 am
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